tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-73042886598650075.post7276564589178576893..comments2024-03-22T11:37:52.668-05:00Comments on Byzantine, Texas: Antioch: As things stand, we're not going to Crete either.Byzantine, TXhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/17845681957622343484noreply@blogger.comBlogger13125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-73042886598650075.post-20928099006010247272016-06-07T17:07:36.817-05:002016-06-07T17:07:36.817-05:00I agree with Jake.I agree with Jake.rhartschttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02005412818602247908noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-73042886598650075.post-78154728024183647852016-06-07T17:07:32.309-05:002016-06-07T17:07:32.309-05:00I agree with Jake.I agree with Jake.rhartschttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02005412818602247908noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-73042886598650075.post-54485486790016316632016-06-07T16:31:00.648-05:002016-06-07T16:31:00.648-05:00Well, the EP is of course a shadow of what it once...Well, the EP is of course a shadow of what it once was - indeed it is an anachronism on all significant levels and is "Ecumenical" in name/symbolism only. Its handling of the calendar, "ecumenism", modern issues, etc. of the last 100 years or so should have signaled to everyone that it simply is not up to the task of a "Great and Holy" council in my opinion. Even if you approve of the general direction the EP would have the Church go, you have to admit its current situation is untenable and it simply is not going to do something significant (i.e. a "Great and Holy" council) on the level it should be done.<br /><br />I am waiting for God to rectify the existential and ecclesiastical situation of the EP (which I think means dissolving it) before the next "Great and Holy" council REALLY happens...<br /><br />I speak as someone "in the diaspora" under the EP...Jakehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/16152024447008244670noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-73042886598650075.post-12206041935420340742016-06-07T16:27:32.345-05:002016-06-07T16:27:32.345-05:00There are some extremely complicated politics at p...There are some extremely complicated politics at play behind the scenes, in the background there's Qatar's heavy investment on the rebel side in the war in Syria and the fact that permission to have a parish was obtained from the emir of Qatar by the Greek-American US ambassador to Qatar at the time.<br /><br />If you see the timeline I linked to above, every action by Antioch has been met by increasingly unhinged escalation by Jerusalem, so direct bilateral talks do not seem to have ever been a possiblity. <br /><br />They did sit down together in June 2013, under the auspices of the Greek Foreign Ministry, but Jerusalem reneged on the agreement that was reached there almost before they even got home.Samn!https://www.blogger.com/profile/14142811721903345946noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-73042886598650075.post-67855166803236152822016-06-07T15:41:54.495-05:002016-06-07T15:41:54.495-05:00Great points but you're not accounting for the...Great points but you're not accounting for the fact that a lot of these issues are just coming to the fore. Many have just see these documents for the first time only months ago, there seems to be serious confusion about who's calling the shots. In Jan 2016 Met. Hierotheos asked these questions:<br /><br />Which Permanent Holy Synod approved the revision of these specific texts of the Pre-conciliar Pan-Orthodox Meetings?<br /><br />Which Permanent Holy Synod dealt with these subjects and which remarks were made?<br /><br />Which and how many Hierarchs were aware of the parts which were revised?<br /><br />Why were these texts not put forward for approval by the Hierarchy and referred to the Holy and Great Synod without the knowledge of the Hierarchs?<br /><br />How many Hierarchs were aware of the revised texts, with the exception of us Metropolitans of the Synod, who were recently made aware of them, meanwhile they were approved by the representatives of the Autocephalous Churches and sent to the Holy and Great Synod?<br /><br />And he's a highly knowledgable Hierarch in the Church of Greece! Years to raise objections seems inaccurate. maximushttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01086218903799586114noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-73042886598650075.post-59836375540294252752016-06-07T15:01:54.069-05:002016-06-07T15:01:54.069-05:00I wasn't implying (on purpose) that Bulgaria w...I wasn't implying (on purpose) that Bulgaria was some nouveau Orthodox patriarchate. If Bulgaria doesn't like those Faith issues she can vote no. A single vote kills the paper. If she doesn't go at all she has no vote and it gets approval. So why not just go?<br /><br />75% of Bulgarians are Orthodox. 10% are Muslim. I'd say that's a solidly Orthodox country. Especially when compared to the Middle East.<br /><br />As for Antioch. If the EP is the first among equals and arbiter of problems she has done an awful job here. Antioch has warned the EP for a long, long time that not acting would end with this action.<br /><br />Bulgaria has had years to raise objections or declare documents received unacceptable. Fewer than 30 days from a scheduled council seems an odd time to raise objections and step away from the event.Byzantine, TXhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/17845681957622343484noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-73042886598650075.post-18723990365177382612016-06-07T14:51:41.748-05:002016-06-07T14:51:41.748-05:00I dont understand this:
"Antioch is no Bulg...I dont understand this: <br /><br />"Antioch is no Bulgaria. This is a see that is both manifestly ancient and one that is uniquely equipped to speak to the issues of inter-religious relations, problems in the modern world, the suffering of Christians, and the refugee crisis."<br /><br />Orthodoxy in Bulgaria is ancient, although the nation became Christian in the 900s. And which modern nation doesn't deal with inter-religious problems? Granted, Antioch is at the forefront of the issues you listed at the present time but Bulgaria's objections on the basis of the Faith, is no less valid than Antioch's on the basis of territory. Even more valid in my estimation.<br />maximushttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01086218903799586114noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-73042886598650075.post-68127435831841508922016-06-07T14:41:24.317-05:002016-06-07T14:41:24.317-05:00Can anyone say with clarity *why* the Phanar has i...Can anyone say with clarity *why* the Phanar has ignored Antioch's pleas for help with the Jerusalem matter? It seems like it should be a pretty simple thing to work out. Honestly, it's rather shocking and petty that Antioch and Jerusalem couldn't resolve it on their own...Anonymoushttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02219625736934205767noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-73042886598650075.post-6301344036950817182016-06-07T12:26:54.637-05:002016-06-07T12:26:54.637-05:00It might be helpful to refer to a timeline of the ...It might be helpful to refer to a timeline of the Qatar issue, that shows just how long Antioch has been asking Constantinople to intervene and just how much Jerusalem has (at least rhetorically) ratcheted up its claims beyond just Qatar-- including claiming jurisdiction over all Syria and in one case fabricating statements by Patriarch John X in order to slander him....<br /><br />http://araborthodoxy.blogspot.com/2016/06/a-dossier-on-qatar-issue.htmlSamn!https://www.blogger.com/profile/14142811721903345946noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-73042886598650075.post-39709824891502653932016-06-07T12:15:32.386-05:002016-06-07T12:15:32.386-05:00The new factor in the past two weeks is that Const...The new factor in the past two weeks is that Constantinople has stated that any mediation between Antioch and Jerusalem has to wait until after the council. For a few weeks before that, Antioch had been publicly stating that it hoped that its correspondence with the EP in early April would lead to a resolution before the council, strongly implying that this is what would happen if the EP didn't act.Samn!https://www.blogger.com/profile/14142811721903345946noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-73042886598650075.post-7471153979648342242016-06-07T11:46:08.141-05:002016-06-07T11:46:08.141-05:00It seems like they used the Bulgarian decision as ...It seems like they used the Bulgarian decision as political cover to announce they aren't coming. They figured once one church doesn't come, unity is broken, so what does it matter if two don't come. There's nothing in here they didn't know about weeks ago, so just releasing it now seems very suspicious.Christopherhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/04814641376923337134noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-73042886598650075.post-44961168328313252132016-06-07T11:41:07.485-05:002016-06-07T11:41:07.485-05:00Agreed, but without the Jerusalem issue would Anti...Agreed, but without the Jerusalem issue would Antioch not come? My guess is that they'd still have complaints but would be coming.Byzantine, TXhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/17845681957622343484noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-73042886598650075.post-64650469982717605452016-06-07T11:36:55.293-05:002016-06-07T11:36:55.293-05:00The schism with Jerusalem seems to be primary but ...The schism with Jerusalem seems to be primary but definitely not the sole objection by Antioch. The Anti-Gnostichttps://www.blogger.com/profile/04386593803225823789noreply@blogger.com