tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-73042886598650075.post1830563491801001804..comments2024-03-22T11:37:52.668-05:00Comments on Byzantine, Texas: "The Rising Tide of Religious Nationalism"Byzantine, TXhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/17845681957622343484noreply@blogger.comBlogger14125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-73042886598650075.post-19730001363782529272021-08-03T12:00:42.763-05:002021-08-03T12:00:42.763-05:00The Abp. makes a very strong point about illiberal...The Abp. makes a very strong point about illiberal religious nationalism centered in Russia but blunts it mentioning the Phanar’s ham-handed efforts to oppose it, if that’s what you call splitting churches all across the former Soviet Union and Eastern Bloc.<br /><br />Rather than aim as hominems at the Phanariot, I choose to listen to what he says about the dangers of the illiberal theocratic impulse now rampant worldwide. Iran and Turkey are directly comparable to Russia at this point in their construction of a totalitarian religion-as-statecraft. The Abp. is nowhere near alone in noticing this. But if you like your religion with a strong dose of authoritarianism and bigotry, I’m sure his words will find no resonance among you.Lance H.https://www.blogger.com/profile/16533031442254954096noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-73042886598650075.post-26466713932459667552021-07-26T14:36:46.535-05:002021-07-26T14:36:46.535-05:00Freedom, liberty, inclusivity, justice, pluralism,...Freedom, liberty, inclusivity, justice, pluralism, modern (and their antonyms of "prejudice, nationalism, non-modern...") are how all Integrationists (whether they are Orthodox, RC, Protestant) see the the world and Christianity in it. They are Classical Liberals in mind and heart.Jakehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/16152024447008244670noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-73042886598650075.post-59681763740331430572021-07-26T14:30:47.430-05:002021-07-26T14:30:47.430-05:00This comment has been removed by the author.Jakehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/16152024447008244670noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-73042886598650075.post-53557132688116726782021-07-26T14:29:38.224-05:002021-07-26T14:29:38.224-05:00This comment has been removed by the author.Jakehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/16152024447008244670noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-73042886598650075.post-4784663447419885592021-07-26T14:21:42.983-05:002021-07-26T14:21:42.983-05:00Indeed. The Orthodox Integrationists failure to s...Indeed. The Orthodox Integrationists failure to see that Classical Liberalism and the secular culture/morality/lifestyle it produces is not Christian or Christian compatible (in theology, philosophy, life, culture, etc.) is a basic failure of *discernment*. In other words they have failed to not be slaves to "the spirit of the age". <br /><br />Some RC see this as well - indeed as well as the few in modern Orthodoxy who really got it (Schmemann), such as Ratzinger, Hanby and others:<br /><br />https://static1.squarespace.com/static/5bb7cb2193a632487214565f/t/603956e7bd383e4d84e937e1/1614370537086/Hanby+-+The+Birth+of+the+Liberal+Order+and+the+Death+of+God.pdfJakehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/16152024447008244670noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-73042886598650075.post-7613721621592332662021-07-25T19:09:26.999-05:002021-07-25T19:09:26.999-05:00Yes. I am sympathetic too. The Empire vanished. Th...Yes. I am sympathetic too. The Empire vanished. Then the monarchies vanished. So now the EP puts its lot in with secular liberalism (like the Catholics) just as it starts to vanish into history.<br /><br />I think what the EP and others fail to realize is that liberalism has morphed into a competing religion that seeks to replace Christianity as completely as Christianity did the Greco-Roman and Germanic pantheons.The Anti-Gnostichttps://www.blogger.com/profile/04386593803225823789noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-73042886598650075.post-76472915605707968272021-07-25T19:00:01.194-05:002021-07-25T19:00:01.194-05:00Worse. Accede to the Muslim Turkish government'...Worse. Accede to the Muslim Turkish government's requirement of Greek ancestry for the Patriarchal throne, then fret over nationalism.<br /><br /><i> If anything only America has an opportunity to apply a universal, non-ethnic Orthodoxy</i><br /><br />This cuts two ways. Yes, America is a multi-ethnic (there is no such thing as "non-ethnic") empire. And yes, America will end as all empires end.<br /><br />Also, good comment, Michael Bauman.The Anti-Gnostichttps://www.blogger.com/profile/04386593803225823789noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-73042886598650075.post-34322297623451131882021-07-25T14:59:24.807-05:002021-07-25T14:59:24.807-05:00Bozo2U,
I question if there is such a thing as &q...Bozo2U,<br /><br />I question if there is such a thing as "non-ethnic" Orthodoxy. <br /><br />Part of the problem of being in the United States is that we do not recognize genuine difference and celebrate it. I am not talking about the 58000 genders, etc.,but the clear differences in race, language and culture that actually exist as Godly variety. <br /><br />God is one, but He fills all of His creation. The problems come when I think my prejudice and preference are of God. Like the Greeks, some Arabs, etc. Michael Baumanhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03025213649848660526noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-73042886598650075.post-38006775767586217682021-07-24T17:40:52.127-05:002021-07-24T17:40:52.127-05:00"My fellow laborers in the field of human fre..."My fellow laborers in the field of human freedom and inclusivity..." Is that how he, an Orthodox Archbishop conceives of himself? Kyrie eleison.Abbot Theodorehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09033976541107844341noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-73042886598650075.post-80395983410746386902021-07-24T12:30:13.064-05:002021-07-24T12:30:13.064-05:00"...Democracy still finds a way in the imagin..."...Democracy still finds a way in the imagination of peoples who yearn for liberty. That is why the cultivation of indigenous democratic forms of government – not the imposition from without – is an answer for both the state and the religious culture."<br /><br />Replace "Democracy" with the more accurate "Classical Liberalism" here and you have the key to Archbishop Elpidophoros, and in truth GOA's/Greek America and by reason of a dependent relationship the EP's, central philosophy and even "ontology" - way of understanding and being a person in the world. <br /><br />In other words, this is his/their answer to "Christ and Culture", but even more than that Classical Liberalism is a commitment to a theological anthropology and everything that derives from it including politics, culture and how to "be Church" in it, etc.<br /><br />Thing is he/they are yesterday's Liberal (in a philosophical sense) and Integrationist. The Catholic Integrationists are far ahead of him/them. For example they at least admit and try to address (ultimately unsuccessfully) the failure of Classical Liberalism to create humane (let alone Christian) society/culture on its own terms, to say nothing of the obvious conflicts its view of man has with Christianity. <br /><br />Add to this the fact that Classical Liberalism is imploding in on itself due to its internal contradictions and the energy unleashed by the sexual revolution, and Archbishop Elpidophoros/GOA/EP come across as what they are - anachronistic Classical Liberals of the cold war/1960's variety, sloppily groping to apply a world view that even their own compatriots(e.g. in Liberal Protestantism, Liberal Catholicism, and the Democratic Party) have moved on from...mostly, NPR perhaps not. <br /><br />I feel for the EP (of the last 100 years), for to commit to CL as the "answer" to not only the perennial "Christ and Culture" question in general, and his specific existential crises in Islamic Turkey, reveals a historical and intellectual shallowness, isolation, and even decadence. The Russians, for all their very real problems, at least are not decrepit Liberals from the 1960's... Jakehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/16152024447008244670noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-73042886598650075.post-38096755455994633342021-07-24T12:17:26.633-05:002021-07-24T12:17:26.633-05:00Interesting to see who was not there, and how much...Interesting to see who was not there, and how much Hellenism was foisted on the laity and hierarchs. So what was the Christian charity purpose.r j klanckohttps://www.blogger.com/profile/18000371679565046691noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-73042886598650075.post-48117019918015140192021-07-24T08:35:24.573-05:002021-07-24T08:35:24.573-05:00[insert nation-state] Orthodox Church and then fre...[insert nation-state] Orthodox Church and then fret over nationalism? Am under the impression that the church-state was founded by a politician around 380 AD. If anything only America has an opportunity to apply a universal, non-ethnic Orthodoxy as we shed off the Old World stupidity found in men, not from HimBozo2Uhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01135391107531325048noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-73042886598650075.post-2164549237540202802021-07-23T20:58:28.032-05:002021-07-23T20:58:28.032-05:00Thank God we can ignore nonsense like this as indi...Thank God we can ignore nonsense like this as individuals, it doesn't have any real impact on our ability to work out our salvation. But from the perspective of church unity, one wonders how much more toxic division can be tolerated before an even wider schism occurs. Sojournerhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09849986892411111836noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-73042886598650075.post-75188439962481717742021-07-23T13:31:13.496-05:002021-07-23T13:31:13.496-05:00💩💩B Bhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08129821596831863015noreply@blogger.com