He's pretty clear on that point. The below from Patriarch Irinej's Nativity Encylical available here.
(SOC) - "... our very close and brotherly Ukraine, where the passion filled chauvinist-Russophobes, led by corrupt politicians with the assistance of Uniates and, unfortunately, with the uncanonical cooperation of the Ecumenical Patriarchate, deepened and spread the existing schism and seriously jeopardized the unity of Orthodoxy in general."
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Patriarchs have gone astray and signed heretical documents before, and thankfully just as then, we still have faithful hierarchs now to denounce their actions and defend the truth. This situation is discouraging and worrisome, but thank God its clear that there are still faithful shepherds.
ReplyDeleteWho has issued a heretical document?
DeleteWell perhaps heretical was not the accurate term in this case. Uncanonical. Schismatic. My main point was that this is not the first time a hierarch has signed a document that is contrary to the Church’s teachings or canons, or attempted to force the Church into a false union with schismatics. Thankfully Christ is in charge, and there are always faithful hierarchs who speak out against such actions.
DeleteIt seems self-evident that over the last few years Constantinople's bold & deliberate aberrations in ecclesiology (expressed initially in words via a number of papers, speeches & letters and most recently by its actions in the Ukraine) have moved from the controversial fringes, across the boundary of Orthodoxy & are now located squarely in the space of heresy.
DeleteIf unilaterally lifting anathemas, excommunications & depositions made by the Moscow Patriarchate, which Constantinople both agreed with & publicly supported for years until just recently, & then declaring 2 groups of schismatics to be the canonical Church (and declaring the canonical Church to be schismatics!) without any repentance or reconciliation from the schismatics AND recognizing men as bishops who were "ordained" by men who weren't even bishops in the first place isn't enough proof that the EP's ecclesiology is heretical then surely the EP's claims about itself are.
How else are we to interpret claims such as the Ecumenical Patriarch is "First Without Equals" & that without the EP the other autocephalous Orthodox Churches are "as sheep without a shepherd", that the EP "indisputably has the responsibility to judge ecclesiastical matters everywhere & to give them a final conclusion", that "Orthodoxy cannot exist without the Ecumenical Patriarchate" because the EP is "the head & origin of all local Churches" since "In the beginning was the Word & the beginning of the Orthodox Church is the EP, the light & life of the Churches"? I could go on & on, but these recent statements are more than sufficient to illustrate the point.
Who has issued a heretical document? Met Elpidophoros, for one...
DeleteThat logic doesn’t play out very well when you consider EPB has American and NATO backing, along with most of the West, and has been making power plays against Moscow since the days of communism when Constantinople annexed portions of Moscow’s jurisdiction while they were helpless to protest under communist yoke.
DeleteThere have certainly been heretical statements made in Constantinople, but they have largely been ignored. This is different, this is a concrete action that is breaking canon law, and Church order, and if Constantinople can land grab Ukraine, it can land grab anywhere.
I don’t think the other hierarchs will fail to miss that detail, it is no doubt a large part of why no one, repeat no one, has openly supported EPB’s choice here. In fact almost every single branch of the Church has made statements condemning EPB’s actions, or said we need a council; implicitly rejecting Constantinople’s claim to universal final authority in such matters.
David, you said "...so the EP hit the reset button on EVERYBODY." This is the point. Orthodox ecclesiology doesn't work this way.
DeleteThe EP is not only saying but more importantly doing crazy unilateral things that affect the whole Orthodox Church despite the objections of the rest of the Church. It is not merely "overstepping his authority" it is ecclesiological heresy.
It appears that Patriarch Bartholomew's "long term goal is the abolition of the Ecumenical Patriarchate". Moscow & the canonical Church of the Ukraine under Met. Onufriy along with the rest of the autocephalous Orthodox Church (including the Greek ones!) are interested in Orthodoxy not some heretical ecclesiology that the EP has developed.
Sadly, we are likely witnessing the flash right before the lightbulb burns out & the Ecumenical Patriarchate becomes a page in the history books with universal primacy defaulting to Alexandria.
AXIOS!
ReplyDeleteAxios! Also see Patriarch Irenaeus in a 10 minute video with English subtitles on the Patriarch of Constantinople and the Ukraine: 10 pithy minutes of blessed sanity, brotherly love, and canonic principles. https://youtu.be/u5qYS2dKsN8
ReplyDeleteRemember the example of St Anthanius the Great. Sometimes it is the rest of the Church that is wrong. Concensus is no guarantee of Truth.
ReplyDeleteIf the EP is right in their sudden embrace of this ecclesiology, then the church has been wrong for a thousand years and we all need to become Roman Catholics.
DeleteJohn: that's my read on it as well and why what the EP is doing is in no way acceptable. Those who support the EP's actions should very seriously ask themselves if they are closet Roman Catholics.
DeleteThis comment by Fr. Gregory implying that the EP is the only Orthodox Church that is correct seemed so unreasonable in contrast to the reality that is unfolding over these last few months that I did a quick Google search & learned that he is the pastor of Sts. Cyril & Methodius UKRAINIAN Orthodox Church, which is under the omophorion of Archbishop Daniel of the Ukrainian Orthodox Church of the USA, a part of the Ecumenical Patriarchate. Archbishop Daniel was one of the two exarchs that Patriarch Bartholomew sent to the Ukraine to prepare for the "unification council" of 12/15/2018 & the "tomos of autocephaly" that was granted to the two schismatic groups in the Ukraine yesterday...what a shocker!
ReplyDeleteWithin the EP it seems like the classic tale of "The Emperor's New Cloths", while the rest of the Orthodox Churches are scratching theirs heads in bewildered & disgust trying to figure out why Patriarchate Bartholomew is prancing around stark naked. The whole thing is embarrassing & discouraging to say the least.
Timmy,
DeleteNo doubt I was unclear. My point in referencing St Athanasius was not to suggest "that the EP is the only Orthodox Church that is correct" but to point out how consensus isn't a particularly useful standard for determining the truth. What does consensus even mean? Is it 100% agreement of all the Churches? 60%? If the four ancient patriarchates agree among themselves is this canonically or binding on the newer Churches?
It seems to me that without a clear agreed upon definition, "consensus" might not be anything different than a heckler's veto. Not saying it is. But at the moment, many people seem to be equating "consensus" with majority rule.
Fr. Gregory, I completely agree with you on this point. The example of St. Mark of Ephesus being literally the only Orthodox bishop of the Patriarchate of Constantinople present at the council of Ferrara-Florence who refused to sign the union with Rome on the basis that Rome was in both schism & heresy is a single but sufficient example. St. Athanasius, as you mentioned, is another excellent example.
DeleteHowever, in this case both the words & actions of the Ecumenical Patriarch & his metropolitans are sufficient for self-condemnation. Thankfully, the other autocephalous Orthodox Churches see this crystal clearly & they are all in agreement on this. They are appropriately & graciously giving the EP time to repent before taking action.
We haven't had an Ecumenical Council since the 8th century because there simply wasn't a need for one. There weren't any heresies ravaging the entire Church.
However, the ecclesiological heresies that the Ecumenical Patriarchate have developed since the early 1920s beginning with Meletius Metaxakis have made the EP's recent actions inevitable so we may very well be living at a time when we witness the 8th Ecumenical Council. I quite literally pray that it will not be so.